zero2dash
Sep 18, 01:44 PM
Plenty of people ran NT on their desktops.
Admission of your mistakes is a good step in becoming a better person.
Key word being DESKTOPS.
MP machines were server based long before they were included in desktops. I'd like to see where people had dual Xeon based DESKTOPS 'cause I've never seen it. It's not impossible but it's also not a good cost-based answer either. :p
The server/desktop division with Windows - as with OS X - is one of marketing, not software. Windows "Workstation" and Windows "Server" use the same codebase.
I never said otherwise.
The hardware they run on is where it differentiates.
Most people/corporations run server-based OS on servers and workstation-based OS on desktops (or "workstations" in the business world). It's not impossible to run a server OS on a desktop or a workstation OS on a server but it is incredibly stupid.
Well, if you can't find evidence of Windows running on well on machine with >2 processors, or of the significant low-level changes Microsoft have made to ensure it does, you aren't looking very hard.
Bad dual core support? Citations please. I think this is a case where a Mac fan is simply speaking out of ignorance of their "enemy" platform.
I erronously bundled in "dual core" with "sketchy 64-bit support". Don't know why. From what I hear, 64-bit support in XP64 is sketchy because of device driver issues (and drivers not being natively 64-bit). I don't have any true 'dual core' systems myself but my P4 3.0C HT works fine in XP Pro. I apologize for lumping in "dual core" in.
Similarly, if you're one of the "Vista is just XP with a fancy skin" crowd, you've obviously not done much research. The changes in Vista are on par with the scale of changes Apple made to NeXT to get OS X.
User Account Protection is a big change. I've seen the list of "new features" and it doesn't do anything for me. UAP is nice...it's just really late. I'm sure there's changes "under the hood" like the ones implemented in XP sp2 to prevent buffer/stack overflows, etc. and I'm sure that's what you're referring to.
I think people who say stuff like that are exhibiting a syndrome common to Mac folk who've never spent any time in the PC world -- they take negative comments they remember regarding versions of Windows or the PC experience from about 5 years back and assume they apply to today. XP, for example, really was for the most part a window-dressing of Windows 2000, but that is not the case for Vista. You see similar statements regarding "blue screens of death", overall system stability, etc, which suggest they haven't seen or used a PC since the late 90s/early 00's.
So - are you inferring that Windows 2000 or Windows XP never blue screen? Because (if you are) that's a load of crap. I've seen blue screens in both OS's. Granted it's usually tied to hardware only, but it still happens. I've had an external USB drive blue screen in XP every time I turned it on, tried on 3 XP computers. Hardware fault, no doubt. Lately my HP Laptop dvd drive has been causing XP Pro to blue screen every other time I insert a dvd-r. Again - hardware fault.
Otherwise are both OS's stable? Damn straight. But problems do occur and I hope you're not suggesting otherwise. No OS is without its flaws.
Admission of your mistakes is a good step in becoming a better person.
Key word being DESKTOPS.
MP machines were server based long before they were included in desktops. I'd like to see where people had dual Xeon based DESKTOPS 'cause I've never seen it. It's not impossible but it's also not a good cost-based answer either. :p
The server/desktop division with Windows - as with OS X - is one of marketing, not software. Windows "Workstation" and Windows "Server" use the same codebase.
I never said otherwise.
The hardware they run on is where it differentiates.
Most people/corporations run server-based OS on servers and workstation-based OS on desktops (or "workstations" in the business world). It's not impossible to run a server OS on a desktop or a workstation OS on a server but it is incredibly stupid.
Well, if you can't find evidence of Windows running on well on machine with >2 processors, or of the significant low-level changes Microsoft have made to ensure it does, you aren't looking very hard.
Bad dual core support? Citations please. I think this is a case where a Mac fan is simply speaking out of ignorance of their "enemy" platform.
I erronously bundled in "dual core" with "sketchy 64-bit support". Don't know why. From what I hear, 64-bit support in XP64 is sketchy because of device driver issues (and drivers not being natively 64-bit). I don't have any true 'dual core' systems myself but my P4 3.0C HT works fine in XP Pro. I apologize for lumping in "dual core" in.
Similarly, if you're one of the "Vista is just XP with a fancy skin" crowd, you've obviously not done much research. The changes in Vista are on par with the scale of changes Apple made to NeXT to get OS X.
User Account Protection is a big change. I've seen the list of "new features" and it doesn't do anything for me. UAP is nice...it's just really late. I'm sure there's changes "under the hood" like the ones implemented in XP sp2 to prevent buffer/stack overflows, etc. and I'm sure that's what you're referring to.
I think people who say stuff like that are exhibiting a syndrome common to Mac folk who've never spent any time in the PC world -- they take negative comments they remember regarding versions of Windows or the PC experience from about 5 years back and assume they apply to today. XP, for example, really was for the most part a window-dressing of Windows 2000, but that is not the case for Vista. You see similar statements regarding "blue screens of death", overall system stability, etc, which suggest they haven't seen or used a PC since the late 90s/early 00's.
So - are you inferring that Windows 2000 or Windows XP never blue screen? Because (if you are) that's a load of crap. I've seen blue screens in both OS's. Granted it's usually tied to hardware only, but it still happens. I've had an external USB drive blue screen in XP every time I turned it on, tried on 3 XP computers. Hardware fault, no doubt. Lately my HP Laptop dvd drive has been causing XP Pro to blue screen every other time I insert a dvd-r. Again - hardware fault.
Otherwise are both OS's stable? Damn straight. But problems do occur and I hope you're not suggesting otherwise. No OS is without its flaws.
ergle2
Sep 20, 01:50 PM
No, one that just ignores you and your inquiries because it was already clear where you were coming from..thus I feel no obligation to engage you in my thought process and your self important questioning. Has nothing to do with my maturity, and everything to do with my lack of caring about you or your opinion.
Ah, a response that is pompous, imperious, petulant, inconsistent AND incorrect -- you didn't ignore me, after all, you were simply obnoxious and evasive with a serious of ridiculous replies.
Nice projection with the "self-important", though.
Where I was coming from was purely from a sense of curiosity as to why someone would apparently feel that technology can advance too quickly. It's not unobvious, I grant you, but a rather unobjectionable query to my mind.
Interestingly, it would appear you do care enough about my opinion - or perhaps that of other forum denizens? - to respond in a way you apparently consider to be "clever". Feel free to ignore me -- really, I can take it! I mean, I'm sure I'll probably suffer a couple of seconds of heartbreak sometime around, say, 2020, but I'll survive.
Oh and "thought process" - ROTFL - lovely!
Ah, a response that is pompous, imperious, petulant, inconsistent AND incorrect -- you didn't ignore me, after all, you were simply obnoxious and evasive with a serious of ridiculous replies.
Nice projection with the "self-important", though.
Where I was coming from was purely from a sense of curiosity as to why someone would apparently feel that technology can advance too quickly. It's not unobvious, I grant you, but a rather unobjectionable query to my mind.
Interestingly, it would appear you do care enough about my opinion - or perhaps that of other forum denizens? - to respond in a way you apparently consider to be "clever". Feel free to ignore me -- really, I can take it! I mean, I'm sure I'll probably suffer a couple of seconds of heartbreak sometime around, say, 2020, but I'll survive.
Oh and "thought process" - ROTFL - lovely!
Rt&Dzine
Feb 28, 12:58 PM
A same-sex attracted person is living a "gay lifestyle" when he or she dates people of the same sex, "marries" people of the same sex, has same-sex sex, or does any combination of these things. I think that if same-sex attracted people are going to live together, they need to do that as though they were siblings, not as sex partners. In my opinion, they should have purely platonic, nonsexual relationships with one another.
Heterosexual couples need to reserve sex for opposite-sex monogamous marriage. If I had a girlfriend, I might kiss her. But I wouldn't do that to deliberately arouse either of us. If either of us felt tempted to have sex with each other, the kissing would stop right away. I know of a woman who gave an excellent answer when men asked her why saved sex for marriage. She said, "I"m worth waiting for." She lived by her Catholic convictions, and she wouldn't risk letting any man use her as a mere object, as a mere "sex machine."
Obviously most people, including Catholics, aren't able to adhere to this ideal. So are they not allowed to be married? Obviously not. And I know Catholics who have divorced and remarried. That's equally abhorrent. Yet they're allowed to do this.
Heterosexual couples need to reserve sex for opposite-sex monogamous marriage. If I had a girlfriend, I might kiss her. But I wouldn't do that to deliberately arouse either of us. If either of us felt tempted to have sex with each other, the kissing would stop right away. I know of a woman who gave an excellent answer when men asked her why saved sex for marriage. She said, "I"m worth waiting for." She lived by her Catholic convictions, and she wouldn't risk letting any man use her as a mere object, as a mere "sex machine."
Obviously most people, including Catholics, aren't able to adhere to this ideal. So are they not allowed to be married? Obviously not. And I know Catholics who have divorced and remarried. That's equally abhorrent. Yet they're allowed to do this.
Chupa Chupa
Apr 10, 09:12 AM
Something is rotten in the state of Denmark, and it ain't the whole fact that Apple pushed aside every professional vid company just to announce their product. It's that they never have announced pro-level products at/alongside professional trade shows prior to this. CES is one thing, but I don't ever recall Apple ever placing any presence at/during NAB or AES (the latter of which they would present something related to the Logic Pro) before.
You need to consult a doctor ASAP because your memory isn't so good. It's only been a few years since Apple pulled out of NAB. Prior to that Apple use to announce products alongside NAB all the time. In fact the very first version of FCP was announced at Supermeet.
Since then:
NAB '01: DVD SP 1.5
NAB '02, '03: new versions of FCP
NAB '05, 06, 07, 09: new versions of FCS
Anyone else call BS on that whole article?
Huh? Did you see the video. This is a legit NAB discussion panel. But I see where you are coming from b/c it's completely unlike Apple to go off on a new paradigm. I mean Apple would be the last company to shock customers and the industry by ditching the floppy drive at the peak of it's existence. And it would never just completely rewrite a popular consumer program like iMovie. Or take the lead on a new connector like Thunderbolt. Never, because we all know Apple is a company that follows other's lead. :rolleyes:
I since there will be a lot of the usually howling when this new FCP is previewed. It looks like Apple is taking video editing in a completely new direction, hence the sentimental journey back to the place where FCP was first launched. Based on the video Apple is jettisoning old media (TV, Movie) editing for new media (web). The latter market is bigger and it also fits in better with Apple's new consumer-leaning sales model.
Personally I'm excited to see what Tues brings.
Although a new FCP is great news, I'm wondering if the new Motion is going to be equally exciting. It's about time it stepped up and challenged After Effects.
I suspect Apple did a re-think of the entire suite and the Motion graphics will not only give AE a run for it's money but that Motion will be better integrated into FCP.
You need to consult a doctor ASAP because your memory isn't so good. It's only been a few years since Apple pulled out of NAB. Prior to that Apple use to announce products alongside NAB all the time. In fact the very first version of FCP was announced at Supermeet.
Since then:
NAB '01: DVD SP 1.5
NAB '02, '03: new versions of FCP
NAB '05, 06, 07, 09: new versions of FCS
Anyone else call BS on that whole article?
Huh? Did you see the video. This is a legit NAB discussion panel. But I see where you are coming from b/c it's completely unlike Apple to go off on a new paradigm. I mean Apple would be the last company to shock customers and the industry by ditching the floppy drive at the peak of it's existence. And it would never just completely rewrite a popular consumer program like iMovie. Or take the lead on a new connector like Thunderbolt. Never, because we all know Apple is a company that follows other's lead. :rolleyes:
I since there will be a lot of the usually howling when this new FCP is previewed. It looks like Apple is taking video editing in a completely new direction, hence the sentimental journey back to the place where FCP was first launched. Based on the video Apple is jettisoning old media (TV, Movie) editing for new media (web). The latter market is bigger and it also fits in better with Apple's new consumer-leaning sales model.
Personally I'm excited to see what Tues brings.
Although a new FCP is great news, I'm wondering if the new Motion is going to be equally exciting. It's about time it stepped up and challenged After Effects.
I suspect Apple did a re-think of the entire suite and the Motion graphics will not only give AE a run for it's money but that Motion will be better integrated into FCP.
gnasher729
Jul 20, 05:12 PM
I think Reverse Hyperthreading will have to be processor-bound, like Hyperthreading. Intel has its mitosis project, so let's hope that works out well!
There is no such thing as "Reverse Hyperthreading". This has been completely debunked.
There is no such thing as "Reverse Hyperthreading". This has been completely debunked.
HBOC
Apr 8, 02:29 AM
Best Buy is a strange store. It is the only place where you can be told a computer with an i3 and 8 gbs of ram is better then a MBP simply because it has a picture of an alien on it. Best Buys tech people are fun to talk to because they are normally so wrong and they are the reason for the stupid PC and Mac "Fanboy" arguements. When they want to sell a product they will do all that is in their power to do so.
If the store favors apple they will tell people that every single PC will get a virus and they will need to get really expensive anti-virus that needs to be updated five times a day. If the Store is Bias against apple then macs are incapable of doing PC things such as Word processing. Got to love Best Tards
Really? C'mon. Most Best Buys don't even have an employee maning the Apple section.
Not saying this story is true or false but Best Buy employs non-commissioned based sales staff. There are no quotas to speak of. This is a public company and sales quotas would be accessible to stockholders.
I do not intend to be rude, but there is a difference in HDMI cables, no matter what the Internet tells you. Conductors, shielding materials/layers and the way the connectors are put together are a few differentiators. An AudioQuest Coffee cable, for example, which is several hundred dollars ($600 I believe for a 1.5m) is made of pure silver starting with the tips and going the length of the cable. This is not the same as a no name $5 dollar HDMI cable from Amazon.
That is a little extreme. I can see perhaps there is a difference in a cable that is longer than 10 feet, but really I will not spend more than $4 on a cable. If you can afford a $600 HDMI 3 FOOT cable and are conscious when you buy it (meaning you are willingly being bent over w/o lube), than who cares. Most people that buy those cables have a theatre room, and I am not talking 20x15 rooms. Monster needs to go out of business...
If the store favors apple they will tell people that every single PC will get a virus and they will need to get really expensive anti-virus that needs to be updated five times a day. If the Store is Bias against apple then macs are incapable of doing PC things such as Word processing. Got to love Best Tards
Really? C'mon. Most Best Buys don't even have an employee maning the Apple section.
Not saying this story is true or false but Best Buy employs non-commissioned based sales staff. There are no quotas to speak of. This is a public company and sales quotas would be accessible to stockholders.
I do not intend to be rude, but there is a difference in HDMI cables, no matter what the Internet tells you. Conductors, shielding materials/layers and the way the connectors are put together are a few differentiators. An AudioQuest Coffee cable, for example, which is several hundred dollars ($600 I believe for a 1.5m) is made of pure silver starting with the tips and going the length of the cable. This is not the same as a no name $5 dollar HDMI cable from Amazon.
That is a little extreme. I can see perhaps there is a difference in a cable that is longer than 10 feet, but really I will not spend more than $4 on a cable. If you can afford a $600 HDMI 3 FOOT cable and are conscious when you buy it (meaning you are willingly being bent over w/o lube), than who cares. Most people that buy those cables have a theatre room, and I am not talking 20x15 rooms. Monster needs to go out of business...
addicted44
Mar 26, 01:19 AM
Full-screen apps along is just�why haven�t we been doing this all along?
The first time this thought crossed my mind was when I first used WriteRoom, to write a paper. Many seem to think (and Apple has intimated as much) that Full Screen Apps originated from iOS. I think this is wrong. I think Apple first thought about these with WriteRoom, which is why Pages was the first App to get the Full Screen treatment.
Combining it with the new form of spaces is a genius move though.
The first time this thought crossed my mind was when I first used WriteRoom, to write a paper. Many seem to think (and Apple has intimated as much) that Full Screen Apps originated from iOS. I think this is wrong. I think Apple first thought about these with WriteRoom, which is why Pages was the first App to get the Full Screen treatment.
Combining it with the new form of spaces is a genius move though.
amin
Sep 13, 03:13 PM
The MP is so overkill for my needs right now, I wonder if I'd even notice the difference. I think I'll wait for 32 cores before I update!
yadmonkey
Apr 11, 04:15 PM
My 3Gs contract ends in June and Apple will be pushing it's luck for me to go half a year without me being tempted to jump platforms instead of waiting for the iPhone 5.
I wouldn't worry. I have an insider source who assures me Apple is basing its entire iPhone 5 product launch on when your contract ends. Here's a direct quote from Steve Jobs:
"While the antenna issues forced us to accelerate our product cycle in favor of a redesign a year earlier than expected, and while the earthquake/tsunami disaster in Japan has added several of its own complications, rest assured that Apple will take every conceivable measure to ensure that the iPhone 5 ships at a time close to the end of mlmathews' 3Gs contract. We have been quite fortunate with the success of out iOS devices in recent years, but we're not about to start pushing our luck here."
I wouldn't worry. I have an insider source who assures me Apple is basing its entire iPhone 5 product launch on when your contract ends. Here's a direct quote from Steve Jobs:
"While the antenna issues forced us to accelerate our product cycle in favor of a redesign a year earlier than expected, and while the earthquake/tsunami disaster in Japan has added several of its own complications, rest assured that Apple will take every conceivable measure to ensure that the iPhone 5 ships at a time close to the end of mlmathews' 3Gs contract. We have been quite fortunate with the success of out iOS devices in recent years, but we're not about to start pushing our luck here."
DeBeere
Nov 28, 06:26 PM
And I don't understand why they should...Can somebody explain it?
Thor74
Apr 19, 02:21 PM
Apple better not win this case and anyone who thinks that they should are a fool.
I'm doing my fool dance right now...
We can dance if we want to
We can leave your friends behind
'Cause your friends don't dance and if they don't dance
Well they're no friends of mine
I say, we can go where we want to
A place where they will never find
And we can act like we come from out of this world
Leave the real one far behind
And we can dance :D
I'm doing my fool dance right now...
We can dance if we want to
We can leave your friends behind
'Cause your friends don't dance and if they don't dance
Well they're no friends of mine
I say, we can go where we want to
A place where they will never find
And we can act like we come from out of this world
Leave the real one far behind
And we can dance :D
ChickenSwartz
Aug 27, 10:27 AM
Are you sure that discount applies to the NEW Merom based Macs - I don't think so?
It isn't like they are releasing new computers. They will update the current line. So if MBP, iMac, MB, and Mini get Merom (I know there is debate but...) and they don't include them in the promotion only the MacPro will qualify. That makes for a very stupid promotion end, you usually want your promotions to go out BIG.
It isn't like they are releasing new computers. They will update the current line. So if MBP, iMac, MB, and Mini get Merom (I know there is debate but...) and they don't include them in the promotion only the MacPro will qualify. That makes for a very stupid promotion end, you usually want your promotions to go out BIG.
cjoy
Apr 25, 03:01 PM
Brings to mind:
If you outlaw guns, only the outlaws will have guns.
statistics show that distribution of firearms mainly lead to more homocides and also suicides using firearms.
if guns are outlawed, their distribution is greatly limited, making it a lot harder for outlaws to obtain them.
the more you spread guns, the greater is the risk of them being used in illegal activities.
..oh wait... this forum is about apple and computers, right? :rolleyes:
If you outlaw guns, only the outlaws will have guns.
statistics show that distribution of firearms mainly lead to more homocides and also suicides using firearms.
if guns are outlawed, their distribution is greatly limited, making it a lot harder for outlaws to obtain them.
the more you spread guns, the greater is the risk of them being used in illegal activities.
..oh wait... this forum is about apple and computers, right? :rolleyes:
cozart
Jul 31, 12:00 PM
so i'm having a difficult time deciding what to do.
North Carolina's sales tax holiday is this coming weekend, just a couple of days before WWDC (of course!). i had every intention of buying a MacBook Pro during the holiday, but now i have no idea what to do.
assuming there's not a silent release of an updated MBP tomorrow...
will waiting be worth losing the 7.5% (somewhere between $150 and $200 depending on how i customize it) that i'll have to pay if i don't get it during the holiday?
should i go ahead and get it during tax free weekend in case there's not even an announcement at WWDC? or, if there is an announcement, should i go ahead and get it and then return it within the 14-day window, losing the 10% restocking fee.
so many options and this first-time mac buyer doesn't know what to do!
North Carolina's sales tax holiday is this coming weekend, just a couple of days before WWDC (of course!). i had every intention of buying a MacBook Pro during the holiday, but now i have no idea what to do.
assuming there's not a silent release of an updated MBP tomorrow...
will waiting be worth losing the 7.5% (somewhere between $150 and $200 depending on how i customize it) that i'll have to pay if i don't get it during the holiday?
should i go ahead and get it during tax free weekend in case there's not even an announcement at WWDC? or, if there is an announcement, should i go ahead and get it and then return it within the 14-day window, losing the 10% restocking fee.
so many options and this first-time mac buyer doesn't know what to do!
NoSmokingBandit
Dec 3, 09:54 PM
same here .. on tarmac level there always seems to be 1 car in the bunch who will cause me troubles with being really fast
I ended up bumping my focus's hp to 241 with some kind of mod (i cant remember what i did, i tested everything to see what would get me closest to 245, the limit), reduced the body weight, and put on the semi-racing flywheel. The Tarmac Rally was easy enough after that.
**spoiler alert**
You get a voucher for a "base rally car" for winning. Idk if the prize is always the same for everyone, but i got an 05 Mini. I dont need or want an 05 Mini. I sold it and added it to my Lambo fund.
**end spoiler**
I started the Italian Tour thing earlier today. Half of it is fun but half is just annoying. Theres a race with a murcielago at night, which is awesome but the damn car spins out if you dont hold the wheel perfectly straight while you break or accelerate, making it very difficult to keep any reasonable speed. The Alfa Romeo in the first leg of the tour is almost as bad. But the Ferrari race at Monza? Easy as pie, i got gold on my first attempt without much fight from the AI.
If anyone wants to add me, my PSN name is the same as my MR name: NoSmokingBandit
Perhaps we could trade cars or something. I have an '08 Ferrari California (won from the Pro series Ferrari race) i have no use for, but i really need a Lambo (any will do, needed for the Pro series Lambo race).
I ended up bumping my focus's hp to 241 with some kind of mod (i cant remember what i did, i tested everything to see what would get me closest to 245, the limit), reduced the body weight, and put on the semi-racing flywheel. The Tarmac Rally was easy enough after that.
**spoiler alert**
You get a voucher for a "base rally car" for winning. Idk if the prize is always the same for everyone, but i got an 05 Mini. I dont need or want an 05 Mini. I sold it and added it to my Lambo fund.
**end spoiler**
I started the Italian Tour thing earlier today. Half of it is fun but half is just annoying. Theres a race with a murcielago at night, which is awesome but the damn car spins out if you dont hold the wheel perfectly straight while you break or accelerate, making it very difficult to keep any reasonable speed. The Alfa Romeo in the first leg of the tour is almost as bad. But the Ferrari race at Monza? Easy as pie, i got gold on my first attempt without much fight from the AI.
If anyone wants to add me, my PSN name is the same as my MR name: NoSmokingBandit
Perhaps we could trade cars or something. I have an '08 Ferrari California (won from the Pro series Ferrari race) i have no use for, but i really need a Lambo (any will do, needed for the Pro series Lambo race).
KnightWRX
Mar 26, 07:58 AM
2) $129 is too much. This one cracks me up. Apple is bundling a $500 product into the OS (and other OS based servers are far more expensive) and people think $129 is too much?
Apple is bundling a bunch of GUI management tools, akin to Webmin. Was that worth 500$ before ? Nope. Is it more expensive elsewhere ? No. Let's face it, OS X Server was always a toy Unix compared to other big-Iron Unix systems and even to Linux as far as enterprise support goes. Volume management, hello Cupertino ?
Their old archaic way of managing storage is atrocious and no, I don't necessarily want to hook up with a huge array and run Xsan, I just want to intelligently manage my local storage. No, just RAID1 volumes is not enough, I want my volumes logical and independant of my physical volumes. I want to be able to move logical extents to new physical extents without having to take down anything on the box.
And what about those GUI tools ? I can't even just do X11 tunneling over SSH to my desktop to run them, I have either run their Remote Desktop stuff or use a 3rd party solution like VNC... What good are they ? At least make them web based (HP Systems Management Homepage type stuff) and join in to what the rest of the industry got clued into years ago if you don't want to code GUI stuff over X11.
And other OS based servers are not more expensive. Solaris is free (http://www.oracle.com/technetwork/server-storage/solaris/downloads/index.html). I won't even bother linking to all the free distributions of Linux that are ready for the server (Fedora, OpenSuSE, Arch, Ubuntu). The BSDs. Unix server product vendors make their money off of support contracts, not the actual software itself, an arena Apple obviously wants no part of.
All the bits and pieces of server software is mostly re-packaged open source components nowadays anyhow. Most every vendor out there is using Apache and Tomcat in their web-based products, Postfix on the mail side, I've seen a lot of MySQL and PostgreSQL based products (HP uses both, MySQL I've seen in their Output Manager product, PostgreSQL in their System Fault Management, Symantec uses MySQL for Brightmail), and let's not even get into OpenSSL and OpenSSH...
Heck, even Apple does this. OS X server is just a bunch of open source components packaged up together. Apache, OpenLDAP, OpenSSH, ClamAV...
So please, pretty please, with a cherry on top, let's not call OS X Server something worth 500$ and compare it to "others that are more expensive but in actuality are free to download and run and only expensive to get vendor support for".
This rant was longer than it should have been. I love OS X as a desktop OS. I'd pay 129$ for a Lion upgrade with my eyes closed. Best of both worlds. Unix underpinnings and powerful command-line (everything is there!) with integration for all my server products yet fast and easy to setup GUI that is mostly consistent so as to attract a large user base that makes it a good proposition for commercial software vendors to port their packages to. Apple just never got really serious about the server side of it (and lets face it, it's not their business and they obviously want no part of the entreprise market) and I'm not faulting them for that. Let's not be as disingenious as to claim their selling you a 500$ product for 129$ though.
I'm shocked at how many people are so willing to just wave away all the nice under-the-hood changes and improvements that Snow Leopard offers just because there aren't any super-radical UI changes... really disappointing to be honest. Does it really have to be all flashy to be of interest to you? What, the functional side of things doesn't matter any more?
See how this little change in your comment still makes it apply very much to the MacRumors crowd ? ;) The fact is, you're not really dealing with technical people on MacRumors, no matter how much some of them pretend they are. Heck, some of them still believe that HTML is a programming language and that they are web developers because their tools of choice are PhotoShop and Dreamweaver.
Apple is bundling a bunch of GUI management tools, akin to Webmin. Was that worth 500$ before ? Nope. Is it more expensive elsewhere ? No. Let's face it, OS X Server was always a toy Unix compared to other big-Iron Unix systems and even to Linux as far as enterprise support goes. Volume management, hello Cupertino ?
Their old archaic way of managing storage is atrocious and no, I don't necessarily want to hook up with a huge array and run Xsan, I just want to intelligently manage my local storage. No, just RAID1 volumes is not enough, I want my volumes logical and independant of my physical volumes. I want to be able to move logical extents to new physical extents without having to take down anything on the box.
And what about those GUI tools ? I can't even just do X11 tunneling over SSH to my desktop to run them, I have either run their Remote Desktop stuff or use a 3rd party solution like VNC... What good are they ? At least make them web based (HP Systems Management Homepage type stuff) and join in to what the rest of the industry got clued into years ago if you don't want to code GUI stuff over X11.
And other OS based servers are not more expensive. Solaris is free (http://www.oracle.com/technetwork/server-storage/solaris/downloads/index.html). I won't even bother linking to all the free distributions of Linux that are ready for the server (Fedora, OpenSuSE, Arch, Ubuntu). The BSDs. Unix server product vendors make their money off of support contracts, not the actual software itself, an arena Apple obviously wants no part of.
All the bits and pieces of server software is mostly re-packaged open source components nowadays anyhow. Most every vendor out there is using Apache and Tomcat in their web-based products, Postfix on the mail side, I've seen a lot of MySQL and PostgreSQL based products (HP uses both, MySQL I've seen in their Output Manager product, PostgreSQL in their System Fault Management, Symantec uses MySQL for Brightmail), and let's not even get into OpenSSL and OpenSSH...
Heck, even Apple does this. OS X server is just a bunch of open source components packaged up together. Apache, OpenLDAP, OpenSSH, ClamAV...
So please, pretty please, with a cherry on top, let's not call OS X Server something worth 500$ and compare it to "others that are more expensive but in actuality are free to download and run and only expensive to get vendor support for".
This rant was longer than it should have been. I love OS X as a desktop OS. I'd pay 129$ for a Lion upgrade with my eyes closed. Best of both worlds. Unix underpinnings and powerful command-line (everything is there!) with integration for all my server products yet fast and easy to setup GUI that is mostly consistent so as to attract a large user base that makes it a good proposition for commercial software vendors to port their packages to. Apple just never got really serious about the server side of it (and lets face it, it's not their business and they obviously want no part of the entreprise market) and I'm not faulting them for that. Let's not be as disingenious as to claim their selling you a 500$ product for 129$ though.
I'm shocked at how many people are so willing to just wave away all the nice under-the-hood changes and improvements that Snow Leopard offers just because there aren't any super-radical UI changes... really disappointing to be honest. Does it really have to be all flashy to be of interest to you? What, the functional side of things doesn't matter any more?
See how this little change in your comment still makes it apply very much to the MacRumors crowd ? ;) The fact is, you're not really dealing with technical people on MacRumors, no matter how much some of them pretend they are. Heck, some of them still believe that HTML is a programming language and that they are web developers because their tools of choice are PhotoShop and Dreamweaver.
DoogieWoogie
Nov 29, 03:37 PM
I don't usually rate threads negative or positive but this time I'll make an exception - NEGATIVE. This is bad news.
iliketyla
Mar 31, 07:05 PM
Precisely. I've been using HTC Android phones concurrently with my iPhones since I have multiple lines. I happen to like both platforms.
What the Android haters here fail to realize, is that they cannot act like adults and say I like this about my iPhone far better than Android.
Nooooo. They've got to preface it with something derogatory like "crappy Android" or worse. It shows their immaturity and inability to act intelligent. They reduce themselves to childish dolts. Idiots at best.
Maybe we can start a trend here!
As a former iPhone user who switched to Android and has been happy ever since, I will say that I was very happy with my iPhone, but my Android phone offers features that I couldn't imagine living without now.
Both iOS and Android are very nice operating systems, with their own strengths and weaknesses.
For me, Android works.
What the Android haters here fail to realize, is that they cannot act like adults and say I like this about my iPhone far better than Android.
Nooooo. They've got to preface it with something derogatory like "crappy Android" or worse. It shows their immaturity and inability to act intelligent. They reduce themselves to childish dolts. Idiots at best.
Maybe we can start a trend here!
As a former iPhone user who switched to Android and has been happy ever since, I will say that I was very happy with my iPhone, but my Android phone offers features that I couldn't imagine living without now.
Both iOS and Android are very nice operating systems, with their own strengths and weaknesses.
For me, Android works.
cvaldes
Mar 22, 02:17 PM
Lack of Flash support is the achilles heel of iPad. I hope Jobs gets off his high horse and relents.
Every day that Flash doesn't live on smartphones and tablets (all manufacturers, not just Apple), more content moves from Flash to HTML5. The relevance of Flash decreases a little bit every single day.
I've been an iPod touch owner since 2007 and I've adapted quite well. I also have an iPad and the Skyfire web browser will do Flash movie conversion.
Lack of Flash on portable devices = not a big deal to Joe Consumer
Every day that Flash doesn't live on smartphones and tablets (all manufacturers, not just Apple), more content moves from Flash to HTML5. The relevance of Flash decreases a little bit every single day.
I've been an iPod touch owner since 2007 and I've adapted quite well. I also have an iPad and the Skyfire web browser will do Flash movie conversion.
Lack of Flash on portable devices = not a big deal to Joe Consumer
savar
Sep 13, 02:35 PM
NOT TRUE....The Quad core G5 people are in an uproar because Logic Pro only uses 2 cores on the G5....they updated Logic Pro so it uses 4 cores, but the G5 Quad still only uses 2 cores....there are also photoshop actions that are NOT multi core aware so will only run on one core.....Hopefully 10.5 will make all this irrelevant.
You totally missed my point. Even if an application uses only one thread at all times, that application is still a separate process from all of the other processes you have running. At any given time you'll have at least 30 something processes, even when no user-land applications are running. OS X will spread out those processes to try to utilize all the cores as much as possible.
In reality, there are probably not too many non-Apple applications which routinely use 8 threads or more. In the near future I expect all applications to use at least 2-3 threads, even the most simple ones.
You totally missed my point. Even if an application uses only one thread at all times, that application is still a separate process from all of the other processes you have running. At any given time you'll have at least 30 something processes, even when no user-land applications are running. OS X will spread out those processes to try to utilize all the cores as much as possible.
In reality, there are probably not too many non-Apple applications which routinely use 8 threads or more. In the near future I expect all applications to use at least 2-3 threads, even the most simple ones.
Nuck81
Nov 12, 02:36 PM
Gah!!
I have it preordered and will be at my moms when it is going to be delivered!!
I have it preordered and will be at my moms when it is going to be delivered!!
DisMyMac
Apr 5, 07:11 PM
Is there any hope for good subtitle support? OCR, etc.?
devman
Aug 6, 02:00 PM
With the iSight and IR sensor rumored to be integrated into the new line of Cinema Displays, i guess apple's gonna adopt HDMI as the IO interface, making Apple one of the first corps to do so. Plus with a HDMI enabled Mac Pro and Leopard fully support it. Why? HDMI is just like ADC, plus its an industry standard port. U need only one cable to have all the communications (FW+USB+Sound+...) going, without having to clutter yr desktop with multiple cables. I see it coming!
I think they'll go UDI instead of HDMI (and save fees). The really interesting question here though is HDCP and what means for all existing hardware including cinema displays...
I think they'll go UDI instead of HDMI (and save fees). The really interesting question here though is HDCP and what means for all existing hardware including cinema displays...
70355
Aug 7, 06:03 PM
Innovation isn't creating new ideas, but improving them.
I guess. If we're allowed to make up our own definitions for words.
If not, Merriam-Webster considers "innovation" to be "the introduction of something new".
I guess. If we're allowed to make up our own definitions for words.
If not, Merriam-Webster considers "innovation" to be "the introduction of something new".
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